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Example Of Initial Counseling 4856 Form: Customize, Finish and forward

welcome back everybody to ask top.sponsored by mentormilitary.com.i'm your host command sergeant major.retired mark garrett.and today in this episode we're going to.talk about how to properly fill out a.daform 4856.there's a lot of different ways to fill.out a 4856 that are correct.and there's also a lot of ways to fill.it out where it's incorrect.and potentially would not be legally.sufficient for some actions whether.that's an article 15.whether that's a separation action so.you want to make sure that whatever you.do.it's at least legally sufficient or.serves the purpose of the counseling.now with that said let's get to it.what's the purpose of our counseling.one of the biggest purposes of.counseling that's overlooked.is telling a soldier they did a good job.so you know we can verbally tell them.they did a great job and that means a.lot.but when you take a few minutes just to.put something down on paper.it means a lot to somebody.set your soldier up for success this.counseling is not the design.to belittle or to destroy.the individual it's designed to set them.up for success so they can overcome.and achieve their goals put the facts on.the table.let's not be emotional let's not be.unspecific.let's talk facts there are times when.perceptions will come into play.and those could be a perception of an.inappropriate relationship.but you have to frame those around.specifics of why that perception.is there gotta help the soldier develop.a plan of action you can guide them.coach them teach them.but the goal here is that they come up.with their plan of action.so that they own it and they're more.likely to do it.and achieve their goal so let's talk.about research.do your research before you start.writing.if you don't do your research you tend.to be emotional when you start writing.understand the situation look at it from.all sides from 360..gather what information you can put down.the facts.then begin to construct your counseling.statement.what regulations cover this issue make.sure you read them.does it say could should would may or.does it say must and will.because there's a lot of difference.between those words because those.determine what is required what action.you must take.what actions you can recommend and how.do you solve it at the lowest possible.level.again set the soldier up for success.by doing your homework making sure you.know the specifics the facts the.regulations and the requirements.you now have the ability to frame a.relationship.ability to frame a counseling statement.so we're going to draft the counseling.statement.we're not going to give this draft to.the soldier this is our.roadmap to the counseling session.we're going to use this to guide our.discussion.if we discover new information the.soldier brings up something.and we're like hey we didn't know that.we need to adjust our counseling.statement.also when you think about new.information.you need to be asking the soldier.open-ended questions.not yes no questions you're looking for.data.ask open-ended questions that require.them to respond.once you have adjusted the counseling.statement now you're going to go get.their signature.so let's look at the administrative data.all that's uh.self-explanatory i am going to talk.about the counseling date.because there's a specific point i want.to talk about in the session closing.block.let's say that you were account you were.counseled on one july verbally.for an incident but you were not.counseled formally until one august.or let's say an event happened on one.july.and nothing happened nobody counseled.you.your squad leaders saw it but it just.kind of happened.now one august comes around.and platoon sergeant wants you counseled.for that event.so what does the squad leader do what.date goes there.well there could be a date of one july.put there.and the purpose of counseling could say.something like.[Music].on one july uh i verbally counseled you.for the following.or it could the date of counseling could.reflect one august.and it could simply say on one july i.observed you doing blah blah blah.that date is important because the date.that goes there.and how the counseling statement is.written determines if.information on the counseling statement.was falsified.i'll go over that as we get the session.closing so you can.kind of grab what i'm saying so the.purpose of the counseling is going to be.very factual and specific.we're going to this this is uh.non-compliance with overweight so.how did we find out about it uh discuss.non-compliance.courses of action solutions and.potential actions for adverse.that could adversely affect the soldiers.career.key points of discussion is the meat and.potatoes of the counseling statement.this is where we're going to tell the.soldier in this case hey.you were you weighed in at this weight.your authorized weight is this.you're being enrolled in the overweight.program here are the steps required by.regulation.and then we're going to finish that up.with a.magic statement it for those of you not.familiar with that.the magic statement is a paragraph.that describes certain things that could.happen to include.separation what types of discharges you.can receive.what type of benefits you may or may not.be entitled to.so keep this very descriptive.unemotional.and try and guide it.towards something positive.so our plan of action this is where the.soldier comes up.with their plan in some cases like this.with an overweight uh statement you're.going to list some specific things they.have to do.and you know they either agree or don't.agree.but the goal of most plans of action are.to get.the soldier to develop their own plan of.action so that they own it.when they own it they're more likely to.do it.so i brought this up earlier we're going.to talk about back dating a counseling.statement.so in the beginning i said something.happened on one july you were either.verbally counseled for it or you weren't.counseled at all.now you're getting canceled and it's one.august.what date goes in the session closing.box one july or one august.my opinion what august goes in the date.of session closing that's the date.you're actually signing it.one july could go in the front part of.the counseling statement in part one.if the counselor wanted to do that.but in my opinion one august should go.on the front.as well and the purpose of the.counseling statement should read.something like.on one july you were verbally counseled.for or i observed you doing this.dating or back dating a counseling.statement.is inappropriate um and it leads to.a question of credibility when you back.date.a counseling statement disagree what.does disagree mean.why is it there um you know when i was.in there was this myth.that your signature did not mean you.agreed with something.it just meant that uh the counseling.took place.where did that come from well va pam.623-3.page 93 and it also is a reference in.southern.several other places states.rated nco's signature does not.constitute agreement or disagreement.with the evaluation of the raiders.senior raider.now somehow that transformed.during my time in the army into hey your.signature just means we counseled you.so go ahead and agree with it because we.counseled you.if you disagree with anything.mark disagree and then.in the session closing block write down.why you disagree.because this is your chance to tell your.side of the story.of what went on so that when a senior.leader looks at the document.they go oh that's what happened maybe i.need to be asking some questions.versus somebody recommending somebody.for an article 15 corrective training.revocation of privileges whatever it is.and they see agree on the back and they.go oh it must have happened that way.yeah let's go ahead and do that.corrective training or whatever was.recommended.very important to disagree if there is.reason to disagree.leader responsibilities this is where.you tell the soldier what you're going.to do.this is the agreement between you and.the soldier the soldier builds the plan.of action and support with you.and you tell them how you gonna support.them so that they're set up for success.assessment to me this is the most.important.part of the counseling form when it.comes to.[Music].making it meaningful this is your.follow-up session.did we achieve our goals now.what's so important about this section.well you're going to follow up depending.on.what occurred it may be a couple days.from the date of occurrence it may be.three months.it's all dependent on the situation but.it must be followed up on.so let's say for example a soldier gets.recommended for an article 15 because of.disrespect.and they're given a formal counseling to.recommend that punishment.now let's say a month and a half later.they've completed all their punishment.and the counselor comes in and says.soldier received an article 15 completed.the punishment phase.and is doing well that's a follow-up.it's done the assessment is done.now let's say that there's going to be a.separation action well.if you don't fill out this assessment.this form is not complete and a good jag.officer.is going to say hey none of these.assessment blocks are filled out.therefore this form is not complete.therefore.you can't use it in the separation.package mark where did you get that at.you're not a jag guy.no i'm not but in some old doctrine 622.appendix b b11 page b20.it states during an event oriented.counseling session.the counseling session is not complete.until.this block is complete so.while this is obsolete doctrine.it shows the military's intent.and i would argue that this is still.relevant today food for thought.make sure you complete your assessments.so what we discussed today.research what you're doing know before.you write.draft your document set the soldier up.for success.counsel then adjust the counseling.statement.provide the document for signature.conduct your assessment.and both of you receive a copy of the.counseling if you look in the footer of.the document.it specifically says that a soldier and.counselor will receive a copy.now i'd like you to reach out to us and.follow us on facebook.and reach down and hit that subscribe.button.for our youtube channel give us a thumbs.up thumbs down make sure you give us.some comments and don't forget.to visit us at mentormilitary.com until.our next episode.stay safe and stay healthy.

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Example Of Initial Counseling 4856 Form FAQs

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Do military members have to pay any fee for leave or fiancee forms?

This question is quite ambiguous. Perhaps the person asking this means to say (a) “How much does it cost for a military person to request leave, thus receive a leave form” … Or, (b) perhaps the person asking this question literally wants to know the monetary cost of an actual leave form….or (c)perhaps what does leave cost in terms of leave accrued IAW the service members Leave and Earnings Statement (LES). I will start by answering: (a) How much does it cost for a military person to request leave, resulting in receiving a leave form (the document that formally authorizes a service member to take Continue Reading

How should I fill out the form at the time of counseling if I want only CSE and none other branches?

If you're confident enough that you will definitely get CSE then fill the names of the institutes in descending order of your preferences , branch being the same ie CSE . Keep in mind that the form once submitted , you can't re-enter in the form filling process . It is always wise to fill names of all the institutes and also that of all the branches in descending order of preferences , because if you can't get CSE in any institute you will be nowhere , resulting to loss of one valuable year of life .

What form is used for army counseling?

Why do people think the 2A covers AR-15 type rifles? We can argue all day long about whether the AR-15 is actually an assault rifle… and those invested in that rifle configuration being an assault rifle will never get it. You really need to understand though, exactly what the Second Amendment is intended to be. It is an attempt by a group of extremely well educated and well intentioned people to provide legal power to citizens. Legal and legitimate power… in case their government goes off the rails and becomes abusive of citizens. It may have some facility in keeping firearms for hunting legal. It Continue Reading

Is there a time limit on counseling a soldier?

I think that the best example of political correctness going too far is described in this story: Academic Activists Send a Published Paper Down the Memory Hole - Quillette Briefly, the following thing happened. Two mathematicians created a paper about Darwin’s hypothesis, which claims that women and men are equal on average, but between men there exists more variability than between women. This hypothesis explains why the majority of very successful people are men, as well as why the majority of very unsuccessful people are also men (e.g. prisoners, homeless people, suicide victims). The paper wa Continue Reading

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